Halloween & the Ulster-Scots (Haleve Nicht)

'A Haunted Halloween In Northern Ireland'

"...Ulster-Scots traditions are not simply a melange of Scots and Irish phenomena. Significant elements are exclusive to Ulster and perhaps most significantly, these communities appear to have generated a distinctive pattern of calender customs with it's own set of cyclical balances and relationships"... American folklorist, Jack Santino, 'Halloween and Other Festivals of Death and Life'.

The word Hallowe’en comes from a Scottish term for All Hallows’ Eve. It is also know as Haleve Nicht in Ulster-Scots.  The date of 31st Oct. was  adopted & Christianised by the church in the 8th century as the eve of All Saints Day, but the day originates with ancient pagan festivals held by the Celtic speaking peoples of Ireland & Britain, particularly the Gaelic festival of Samhain (pronounced ‘Sawin’) & the Briton festival of Calan Gaeaf .  Halloween was and still is one of the most important festivals of the year throughout Scotland & Ireland.  It was the climax of the harvest and throughout the upland areas of Ulster it also marked the traditional date of the return of cattle & their herds from the summer pastures on the mountains. The 1^st of November was the New Year of the Celtic calendar and as such was the most important day of the Celtic year. Halloween was the only one of the ancient Celtic quarter days observed by the Presbyterian communities (the other quarter days being Lughnasa /Lammas, Imbolc & Beltaine).

Ulster-Scots were superstitious people and belief in fairies & the supernatural world was wide-spread. Writing in 1821, the Rev. John McCloskey of Banagher parish, Co Down proposed that the Scots who migrated to Ulster in the seventeenth century came with the "whole train of witches, the tribe of fairies, the overlooking (bewitching) of horses and cows." Some believed that "the Irish & Scots fairies fought regularly every year for control of the magical realms of Ulster.". 

Ulster-Scots Halloween traditions included lighting bonfires, parties with special food & games, practical jokes and children visiting houses guising (wearing a disguise) & rhyming - all with a heightened sense of the supernatural. Turnips were hollowed out and faces carved into the flesh. They were then illuminated by candlelight and put outside the home to ward off evil spirits.

Turnip lanterns

 In Fermanagh it was believed that on the Eve of All Hallows the dead would take revenge for any hurt done to them while alive. So people with troubled consciences avoided graveyards or if they heard steps behind them did not turn around for this meant instant death.

People believed rowan berries gave good health, and if you planted them near grave sites, they would help the dead sleep. They would use Rowan branches as dowsing rods and make crosses of rowan twigs to protect themselves on Halloween. Plants including rowan, hazelnut and elderberry were once thought ‘magical’ trees and shrubs, which could ward off witches and evil spirits. Deadly nightshade (Belladonna), another common plant found in hedgerows, was said to be an ingredient in witches’ brews, while blackthorn is referred to as a witch’s tree.


Hallowe’en was more celebrated for fortune-telling than any other night of the year. In Armagh pairs of nuts were put on the hearth and named after courting couples. The behaviour of the nuts was supposed to be indicative of the future of the couples: if the nuts jumped apart it meant arguments and infidelity, if they stayed together, long life and happiness.

Children went around neighbours houses rhyming in the hope of receiving apples or nuts (or in more recent years, money). The most popular rhyme was a slightly altered version of a Mumming rhyme usually associated with Christmas:

"Hallowe'en is cumin' tha goose is gettin' fat.
Wud ye please put a penny in tha oul man’s hat.
If ye havnae got a penny a ha’pney wull do.
If ye havnae got a ha’pney God bless you.
And yer oul man too."

A 1817 description from Islandmagee, County Antrim read: "On Haleve, alias Hallow-e'en, apples & nuts were eaten, with which young boys & girls often play some harmless tricks, for the purposes of prying into futurity about sweethearts; boys also go about and strike the doors of dwelling houses with cabbages, or the like.". One of the more popular pranks was to remove a gate from a field or garden and place it on a roof to make it look like the work of a devious supernatural being.

Halloweve – An Ulster-Scots poem by Adam Lynn of Cullybacky in Co Antrim, describing typical Halloween customs (circa Oct 1900).

Haleve comes bit yince a year, 
The auld folks used to say ; 
So Wully axed me ower yin eve 
To drink a cup o’ tae; 
So ower goes I, and, boys a dear, 
We had a desplr’t time, . O’ which I wush tae gie some hints 
In this bit simple rhyme 
On Haleve Nicht.

The table sure it almaist groan’d 
Wae iverything you’d name; 
If anything wus left ava 
It was nane 0’ oor blame; 
The tableclaith was then fouled up, 
The fun it did begin, 
I hope the tricks the youngsters played 
Wur tainted not wae sin 
That Haleve Nicht

" Bless me," said I, " what noise is that? " 
The door it got some slaps; 
Said I, ” If this ere hoose wus mine 
I’d go’ot an’ choke them waps.”
J est then we all begun tae sneeze,
No’ yin 0’ us could speak
The hoose it was completely filled
Wae pepper and tow reek
That Haleve Nicht.

As soon as this had cleared  awa’ 
The big tub wus brung in, 
Then for a red-cheek’d epple, ‘od, 
The dookin’ did begin ; 
Anither yin swung frae the roof, 
Beside a lichted split, 
And many a bluidy mooth was got 
By hanching for a bit 
That Haleve Nicht.

A turnip peelin’ was hung up 
Withoot a crack or fla’
An’ yin young lad he’ it’ a her’n,
The heed and banes and a’.
Some roucht at tricks wae luckin’ glass,
An’ ithers wae a plate,
The hale idea was tae ken
Wha’d likely be their mate
Some Haleve Nicht.

Bit naethin’ bate the burnin’ nits, 
And hoo they bleezed thegither, 
'Twas very seldom, I should think, 
They seemed tae like each ither ; 
But is the cause no’ at the heart, 
As some 0’ them hes nane, 
And some hes bad and some hes guid, 
And weer we no’ the same 
This Haleve Nicht ?



Halloween in the USA. 

Although the Christianised All Hallows' Eve was observed in America in the early days by English Anglicans & Catholics, the modern spooky holiday & its supernatural traditions were brought to America by Ulster-Scots, Irish & Scottish immigrants.  Halloween didn't take off as a mainstream secular holiday in the USA until the early 1900's. Up until that point it was more commonly associated with people of a Scottish background than any other ethnic group.

illustration for Robert Burns' Halloween

The first book on the history of Halloween in America ‘The Book Of Halloween’  (1919) describes festivities such as hosting a ‘Scotch party’, using Robert Burns’ poem ‘Halloween’ as a guide to costumes and party games. Burns' poem of 1785 was influential in spreading the customs of the holiday to a wider American audience. Today's American customs of wearing costumes, carving pumpkins and Trick 'r Treating are evolutions of old traditions from Scotland & Ireland.

Early 20^th century Halloween cards in the USA frequently included symbolism such as tartan, thistles and men in kilts (see samples below). They reveal just how closely Scotland was associated with Halloween in American minds…   

CLICK IMAGES TO ENLARGE.

------

Halloween

By Robert Burns, 1759 - 1796

Upon that night, when fairies light

On Cassilis Downans dance,

Or owre the lays, in splendid blaze,

On sprightly coursers prance;

Or for Colean the route is ta’en,

Beneath the moon’s pale beams;

There, up the cove, to stray and rove,

Among the rocks and streams

To sport that night.

Among the bonny winding banks,

Where Doon rins, wimplin’ clear,

Where Bruce ance ruled the martial ranks,

And shook his Carrick spear,

Some merry, friendly, country-folks,

Together did convene,

To burn their nits, and pou their stocks,

And haud their Halloween

Fu’ blithe that night.

The lasses feat, and cleanly neat,

Mair braw than when they’re fine;

Their faces blithe, fu’ sweetly kythe,

Hearts leal, and warm, and kin’;

The lads sae trig, wi’ wooer-babs,

Weel knotted on their garten,

Some unco blate, and some wi’ gabs,

Gar lasses’ hearts gang startin’

Whiles fast at night.

Then, first and foremost, through the kail,

Their stocks maun a’ be sought ance;

They steek their een, and graip and wale,

For muckle anes and straught anes.

Poor hav’rel Will fell aff the drift,

And wander’d through the bow-kail,

And pou’t, for want o’ better shift,

A runt was like a sow-tail,

Sae bow’t that night.

Then, staught or crooked, yird or nane,

They roar and cry a’ throu’ther;

The very wee things, todlin’, rin,

Wi’ stocks out owre their shouther;

And gif the custoc’s sweet or sour.

Wi’ joctelegs they taste them;

Syne cozily, aboon the door,

Wi cannie care, they’ve placed them

To lie that night.

The lasses staw frae ‘mang them a’

To pou their stalks of corn:

But Rab slips out, and jinks about,

Behint the muckle thorn:

He grippet Nelly hard and fast;

Loud skirl’d a’ the lasses;

But her tap-pickle maist was lost,

When kitlin’ in the fause-house

Wi’ him that night.

The auld guidwife’s well-hoordit nits,

Are round and round divided,

And monie lads’ and lasses’ fates

Are there that night decided:

Some kindle coothie, side by side,

And burn thegither trimly;

Some start awa, wi’ saucy pride,

And jump out-owre the chimlie

Fu’ high that night.

Jean slips in twa wi’ tentie ee;

Wha ‘twas she wadna tell;

But this is Jock, and this is me,

She says in to hersel:

He bleezed owre her, and she owre him,

As they wad never mair part;

Till, fuff! he started up the lum,

And Jean had e’en a sair heart

To see’t that night.

Poor Willie, wi’ his bow-kail runt,

Was brunt wi’ primsie Mallie;

And Mallie, nae doubt, took the drunt,

To be compared to Willie;

Mall’s nit lap out wi’ pridefu’ fling,

And her ain fit it brunt it;

While Willie lap, and swore by jing,

‘Twas just the way he wanted

To be that night.

Nell had the fause-house in her min’,

She pits hersel and Rob in;

In loving bleeze they sweetly join,

Till white in ase they’re sobbin’;

Nell’s heart was dancin’ at the view,

She whisper’d Rob to leuk for’t:

Rob, stowlins, prie’d her bonny mou’,

Fu’ cozie in the neuk for’t,

Unseen that night.

But Merran sat behint their backs,

Her thoughts on Andrew Bell;

She lea’es them gashin’ at their cracks,

And slips out by hersel:

She through the yard the nearest taks,

And to the kiln goes then,

And darklins graipit for the bauks,

And in the blue-clue throws then,

Right fear’t that night.

And aye she win’t, and aye she swat,

I wat she made nae jaukin’,

Till something held within the pat,

Guid Lord! but she was quakin’!

But whether ‘was the deil himsel,

Or whether ‘twas a bauk-en’,

Or whether it was Andrew Bell,

She didna wait on talkin’

To spier that night.

Wee Jennie to her grannie says,

“Will ye go wi’ me, grannie?

I’ll eat the apple at the glass

I gat frae Uncle Johnnie:"

She fuff’t her pipe wi’ sic a lunt,

In wrath she was sae vap’rin’,

She notice’t na, an aizle brunt

Her braw new worset apron

Out through that night.

“Ye little skelpie-limmer’s face!

I daur you try sic sportin’,

As seek the foul thief ony place,

For him to spae your fortune.

Nae doubt but ye may get a sight!

Great cause ye hae to fear it;

For mony a ane has gotten a fright,

And lived and died deleeret

On sic a night.

“Ae hairst afore the Sherramoor, —

I mind’t as weel’s yestreen,

I was a gilpey then, I’m sure

I wasna past fifteen;

The simmer had been cauld and wat,

And stuff was unco green;

And aye a rantin’ kirn we gat,

And just on Halloween

It fell that night.

“Our stibble-rig was Rab M’Graen,

A clever sturdy fallow:

His son gat Eppie Sim wi’ wean,

That lived in Achmacalla:

He gat hemp-seed, I mind it weel,

And he made unco light o’t;

But mony a day was by himsel,

He was sae sairly frighted

That very night.”

Then up gat fechtin’ Jamie Fleck,

And he swore by his conscience,

That he could saw hemp-seed a peck;

For it was a’ but nonsense.

The auld guidman raught down the pock,

And out a hanfu’ gied him;

Syne bade him slip frae ‘mang the folk,

Some time when nae ane see’d him,

And try’t that night.

He marches through amang the stacks,

Though he was something sturtin;

The graip he for a harrow taks.

And haurls it at his curpin;

And every now and then he says,

“Hemp-seed, I saw thee,

And her that is to be my lass,

Come after me, and draw thee

As fast this night.”

He whistled up Lord Lennox’ march

To keep his courage cheery;

Although his hair began to arch,

He was say fley’d and eerie:

Till presently he hears a squeak,

And then a grane and gruntle;

He by his shouther gae a keek,

And tumbled wi’ a wintle

Out-owre that night.

He roar’d a horrid murder-shout,

In dreadfu’ desperation!

And young and auld came runnin’ out

To hear the sad narration;

He swore ‘twas hilchin Jean M’Craw,

Or crouchie Merran Humphie,

Till, stop! she trotted through them

And wha was it but grumphie

Asteer that night!

Meg fain wad to the barn hae gaen,

To win three wechts o’ naething;

But for to meet the deil her lane,

She pat but little faith in:

She gies the herd a pickle nits,

And two red-cheekit apples,

To watch, while for the barn she sets,

In hopes to see Tam Kipples

That very nicht.

She turns the key wi cannie thraw,

And owre the threshold ventures;

But first on Sawnie gies a ca’

Syne bauldly in she enters:

A ratton rattled up the wa’,

And she cried, Lord, preserve her!

And ran through midden-hole and a’,

And pray’d wi’ zeal and fervour,

Fu’ fast that night;

They hoy’t out Will wi’ sair advice;

They hecht him some fine braw ane;

It chanced the stack he faddom’d thrice

Was timmer-propt for thrawin’;

He taks a swirlie, auld moss-oak,

For some black grousome carlin;

And loot a winze, and drew a stroke,

Till skin in blypes cam haurlin’

Aff’s nieves that night.

A wanton widow Leezie was,

As canty as a kittlin;

But, och! that night amang the shaws,

She got a fearfu’ settlin’!

She through the whins, and by the cairn,

And owre the hill gaed scrievin,

Whare three lairds’ lands met at a burn

To dip her left sark-sleeve in,

Was bent that night.

Whyles owre a linn the burnie plays,

As through the glen it wimpl’t;

Whyles round a rocky scaur it strays;

Whyles in a wiel it dimpl’t;

Whyles glitter’d to the nightly rays,

Wi’ bickering, dancing dazzle;

Whyles cookit underneath the braes,

Below the spreading hazel,

Unseen that night.

Among the brackens, on the brae,

Between her and the moon,

The deil, or else an outler quey,

Gat up and gae a croon:

Poor Leezie’s heart maist lap the hool!

Near lav’rock-height she jumpit;

but mist a fit, and in the pool

Out-owre the lugs she plumpit,

Wi’ a plunge that night.

In order, on the clean hearth-stane,

The luggies three are ranged,

And every time great care is ta’en’,

To see them duly changed:

Auld Uncle John, wha wedlock joys

Sin’ Mar’s year did desire,

Because he gat the toom dish thrice,

He heaved them on the fire

In wrath that night.

Wi’ merry sangs, and friendly cracks,

I wat they didna weary;

And unco tales, and funny jokes,

Their sports were cheap and cheery;

Till butter’d so’ns, wi’ fragrant lunt,

Set a’ their gabs a-steerin’;

Syne, wi’ a social glass o’ strunt,

They parted aff careerin’

Fu’ blythe that night.

-----

The ancient connection between Scotland, Ulster & Appalachia.

"Scotland and Northern Ireland have many ancient bonds that have endured throughout the aeons of both recorded history and back into the dark shadows of the misty primaeval. The oldest and least known is that they are closely related geologically, both being made up of tertiary basalt, a type of black igneous rock, and carboniferous limestone, a sedimentary rock with marine origins. 

Moreover, Ulster, Ireland's northern-most province, and western Scotland are actually part of the same prehistoric mountain chain, a chain that is millions of years old and that once included the Appalachian Mountains of North America. This geologic connection is quite ironic when one considers that the same stock of people came to live in all three locales in the historic era: the Scots in Scotland, the Ulster Scots in Ulster, and the Scots-Irish, as they came to be known, in America."

E. Estyn Evans, The Personality of Ireland.


UPDATE: There is now an International Appalachian Trail for walkers that stretches across eastern USA, Canada, Ulster, Scotland & western Europe. See the website for the Ulster stretch here... www.walkni.com/iat/

Ulster Tartan

Ulster tartan is basically the only Irish tartan with any historic pedigree. Before Victorian times different tartans didn't represent clans or families  they represented regions. Even this was more by accident than design, it was due to differing styles of local weavers and the limitations of locally sourced natural dyes available. 

'God's Frontiersmen - The Scots-Irish Epic'

In 1988 Channel 4 (UK) in co-operation with Ulster Television produced a four episode mini-series and accompanying book entitled 'God's Frontiersmen - The Scots-Irish Epic' by Rory Fitzpatrick.  The TV production was part drama, part documentary exploring the Ulster-Scot journey from Scotland to Ulster and then for many, onto America. The series containing around 3.5 hours of video was released on VHS in 1989 and possibly on DVD a little later. Both the book and the video are worth trying to track down for anyone interested in Scots-Irish / Ulster-Scot history.

the hardback book

Presented below are a series of clips from TV series plotting part of that journey.... Thanks to YouTube user BickyBox for uploading these clips!


Clip 1
The introduction to 'God's Frontiersmen'. This opening clip looks at an infamous section of the Anglo-Scots border communities who comprised part of the plantation settlers in Ulster; The riding families or Border Reivers.

The Ulster-Scots & The Fiddle.

Fiddle music is of course very popular in Ireland... but few know that the fiddle (or more technically, the violin) along with traditional reels were introduced into Ireland mainly by Ulster-Scots. And within a few generations the Ulstermen took their fiddle music with them to the frontiers of America where in their areas of settlement around the Appalachia it evolved over time into Old-Time and Bluegrass styles....

----------------

The Fidula (medieval fiddle) had been known in Ireland at least since the 1500's but the style of music played on them was much different than the traditional Irish music heard today. The fiddle we know today (the Violin) arrived through Ulster probably early in the 17th century, and with the great movement of people from Scotland to Ulster at that time the popularity of the instrument (and the now traditional reels and strathspeys) spread quickly around the country in areas where the planters settled and beyond.

Playlist of over 70 videos relating to Scots-Irish / Ulster-Scots on YouTube...

watch videos above or click below...

Forged in Ulster video playlist.... click here.

Forged In Ulster's YouTube playlist of over 70 videos relating to Scots-Irish / Ulster-Scots on . History, music & culture from Ulster, America & beyond.

"We're nothing like THOSE Kennedys!" - Book review of 'The Other Irish'

From the Huffington Post...

Book review of 'The Other Irish' by Karen McCarthey.
by: Court Stroud

Click to buy at Amazon

"We're nothing like those Kennedys. They're Catholic!" my petite, schoolmarm grandmother chided through pursed lips. Her terse reply startled me since Kennedy was her maiden name. I never mentioned the matter again, but often wondered why my query upset her so much.

Border Reivers; The ancestors of many Ulster Scots

Anyone who lives in Ulster will be very familiar with surnames such as Armstrong, Irving, Murray, Kerr, Maxwell, Johnstone, Carruthers, Potts, Elliott, Burns, Douglas, Bell, Crozier, Scott & Graham. These are all Border Reiver family names.

Many Ulster-Scots (Scots-Irish) are descended from these Border Reivers;  lawless clans from the border between Scotland & England, where a lifestyle of raiding and marauding was the only way to survive. They started off as subsistence farmers but owing to their geographical position they were frequently harassed by passing armies who, at the very least, would require provisioning, often without payment,  but who were more often hell bent on destroying everything before them and causing as much damage and misery as they could. Crops were destroyed, homesteads burnt and the people murdered or dispersed.

It is no coincidence that these people, having had their crops regularly destroyed and their livestock stolen, looked for other means of sustaining themselves and their families... They took to reiving.

Raiding parties in battle

a short excerpt from Born Fighting on the Reivers 

For over 400 years between the 13th & 17th centuries, warring families from both sides of the lawless border valleys would carry out deadly raids on each other. These skilled warrior horsemen would live a life of looting, arson, murder & rustling.  The life of the Border Reiver was not necessarily ruled by his allegiance to the English or Scottish Crowns, but more likely by his allegiance to a family surname. The history of the Border Reivers has many similarities to that of  the American Wild West. It produced its share of outlaws and broken men, corrupt officials, greed, misery and struggle for survival.

Reiver map of the Scottish - English border

Reiver re-enactors

In 1603 James VI of Scotland became James I of England. He immediately set about unifying the two countries and started by bringing the Reivers under control. Many Reiver families were faced with the choice of hanging or accept exile across the Irish sea to the wild badlands of Ulster as part of James' Plantation project to bring the Irish natives under control.

ballads of the Border Reivers

In Ulster the Border Reiver family names were found in particularly concentrated numbers in county Fermanagh. Are you descended from the Border Reivers? Have a look a this list of the major family names from the Border Reivers website.

The antiquity of the Scots In Ulster

A lot of people like to make the point that the Scottish are in fact ancestrally Irish, which is only partly true. They are usually referring of course to the Scoti, a Latin name given by the Romans to describe Irish raiders, who would loot & plunder parts of northern Britain in the 4th century before later going on to carve out the kingdom of Dalriada. Of course there was already a large population of  indigenous Picts & Britons living in Caledonia (Scotland) long before the arrival of the Scoti. The kingdom of Dalriada and the greater Highlands area has always been sparsely populated and the vast majority of the Scottish people have always lived in the Lowlands. If the Scoti were indeed Irish settlers/invaders of the western Highlands (some academics now doubt this) then it's estimated there would have been only a few thousand souls that settled there during that time.  Today the population of the entire Highlands is less than 5% of the total population of Scotland, even though it covers a third of the country's land mass. In fact there is a lot more traceable Ulster genetic heritage in the Lowlands than there is in the Highlands. So while a portion of Scotland's population overall is undoubtedly descended from the Irish, the majority isn't. 

Ulster-Scottish kingdom of Dalriada

Going in the opposite direction, there has always been migration of people from Scotland to Ulster, stretching back to Mesolithic period when the first humans permanently settled in Ireland. Long before the Plantations, before the Hamilton & Montgomery settlement, before the Gallowglass (the Antrim Scots), the Scots had influence in Ulster.

In the summer of 637, the Battle Of Moira was reputed to be the largest battle ever fought on the island of Ireland. King Congal of Ulster and his allies from Dalriada mustered an army of Ulstermen, Cruthin, Scots, Picts & Anglo Saxons (Sassenachs) to fight against the High King of Ireland, Domnall II. The defeat & death of Congal  led to the loss of Ulaid & Dalriada territory to the Ui'Neills and the retreat of many Ulstermen/Cruthin to Scotland. The Cruthin people of Ulster were referred to by the Gaels as Picts. The Irish word Cruithne meaning that they believed the Cruthin originated in Pritani (or Qritani in Goidelic), which was Britain, most likely from modern day Scotland. Perhaps they had originally spoke the same ancient form of the Brythonic (British) celtic language as the Scottish Picts. Noted historian professor T. F. O'Rahilly said of the Cruthin, that they were "the earliest inhabitants of these islands to whom a name can be assigned".

Battle of Moira, Co. Down 673 A.D.

Even before the Ulster-Scottish kingdom of Dalriada and even before the Cruthin  there were 'Scots' (or rather people originating from northern Britain) in Ulster. One of the earliest known human settlements in Ireland is in Mountsandel, Co. Londonderry, Northern Ireland. It's believed these Mesolithic peoples came here from Scotland, first settling in Co Antrim some 9000 years ago.  It is thought they were attracted to the coast of Co. Antrim in the search for flint, which they would have known was to be found in the limestone cliffs they could see distantly glinting in the sun from  the coast of modern day Scotland. Flint was a rare and valuable commodity in northern Britain. These were amongst Ireland's first people. They would have been descendants of Iberian migrants who first settled southern England and over the course of many generations, as the Ice Age receded, moved up through Britain and finally over to Ireland, maybe via a seasonal land-bridge connecting south west Scotland to the Antrim coast. The ancient stone Court Cairn tombs of the British Isles, built around 6000 years ago in the Neolithic period are most highly concentrated in South west Scotland & North East Ireland. This is proof of a common culture and shared beliefs between Scotland and Ulster going back into the midsts of time.

Mountsandel (1) and other prehistoric sites

artists impression of a Court Cairn tomb

So it is perhaps more accurate to say that the Irish are descended from the people of (what is now called) Scotland. We are indigenous peoples of this land and the migration between Ulster & Scotland has been constant throughout the millennia. Ireland, Scotland and the rest of Britain share the same ancient race of ancestors at their core. For anyone to say the Scots are foreigners in Ulster is plainly wrong and  i would suggest they take a long look back into the depths of Irish history!